Excluding MLMs without being snotty?

I do not and will not ever work with MLM's... and I have no problem saying so...

I see nothing wrong in stating so up front.... nice and simple!

The only problem I have with MLM's- and their cousins, auto sales persons is simply their ability to take advantage of weaknesses we all have. In fact, it is considered a good thing in some industries to know how to get people to do things they'd otherwise not.

I actually had an MLM sales person say to me that it's okay to take advantage of people because they want to be taken! Bad sales person. But the difference, it seems to me, is in the aggressive nature of the pitch, which can escalates until you will do what's not in your best interest. It's a bit like signing a false confession after days of interrogation just to get the interrogators off your back. And it works. That's why torture is illegal in most civilizations throughout the world.

But what if someone is consistently saying to you, "you have the right to leave at anytime...." We are all vulnerable to to psychological manipulation, at least according to Amnesty International, and we should all be taught from a young age to follow our gut feeling- if you don't feel good about what's happening to you, you should be an guard and ready to defend yourself, or change your circumstance immediately.

One of the first "taught" rules to keep the target talking. Often the easiest defense to aggressive sales people is to simply shut down, stop participating, answer enquiries with "hum," and keep in mind that your time and energy are yours to give as you want. If you can leave, do so.

To answer your question simply- I have no problem entertaining MLM's, but I try to keep in mind that I decide how much or how little of my own precious energy to give. And, in 30+ years of being a Freelance Artist I've never known a single person who's made any "real" money under an MLM systems. And there is nothing ever wrong with stating your opinion!

I think that most of us have either been victims or know someone who has been hurt financially by the "pyramid scams" which have become analagous with the MLM industry. There is certainly a visceral reaction to the idea of being involved in the business model and the knee jerk reaction seems understandable.

I would say that 95% of me says that I would not work with an MLM and like Rebecca I would have no problem stating so up front. However, there is a small part of me that feels that perhaps there are opportunities in the MLM industry that might be getting a bad "rap".

I obviously think that's just fine to exclude MLMs (given that we created the no-mlm rules that we enforce here). There seems to be an expectation in business that, if you want to pay for something, then you have a "right" to pay for it. But of course that's simply not the case - for example, just because someone has enough money to attend college at Harvard doesn't mean that university is obligated to accept them. So go ahead, set your own rules and enforce them. My only advice is to be crystal clear about what the rules are, and enforce them evenhandedly.

Hi Brianna

I think your idea of helping women in business and stay at home women is a great one! Seems that there are a lot of people who could really benefit from your advice and expertise.

I agree with the others here who said it should be OK to state that your business will not be working with or endorsing MLM's. It's your business and you can do what you want! Imagine the headache, frustration and bad feelings there might every single time you have to reject someone based on the fact that they are an MLM. This way you won't waste any time.

I know it almost seems like it's in the same vein as saying you won't hire people of a certain religion or color, but it's really not. You are focusing your community and services around a niche and that is good because your time and services are valuable to that certain demographic of women starting out with business/stay at home work. They probably would not want you to be dealing with MLM's either! Especially knowing some of your contacts have gotten hurt / scammed in the past by them.

Let us know how things work out!

I have problem with the word condone that you used on your original post. If you don't want to do business with MLMs that's certainly your right to decide that but some people are good at that and thrive in that environment. Telling them outright that they are wrong for doing so isn't very fair. I have seen people be successful in that arena doing the business the right way. Say you won't work with them, fine, say you don't condone the lifestyle, not fair. Art T.

Of course you will be missing out on helping some people; and of course that's the point of niching yourself.

And if you say you don't condone something at least people know where you stand, fair or not.

Best of luck.

DD

I'd say keep an open mind and keep your client's best interest at heart. I own a company that could be considered a MLM. I don't really classify it as such because we choose not to employ heavy pressure techniques in our business. Consultants work as little or as much as they like, they can sign up people under them and get commissions on sales, but we don't push that factor like most MLMs.

We started in 2003. I look back over our first four consultants--they are still with us. Most of them have children and appreciated the flexibility of working evenings, and having control over their own schedules. All of them have been successful enough to qualify for free trips to Vegas, Mexico and Hawaii--and when they couldn't travel they got laptops. I don't know their personal income information, but I gather its lucrative enough for them to continue doing it!

For some people that level of "self-employment" is enough to juggle. I know from many a night up at 2 am writing catalogue content, or updating the website, I would KILL to have a little LESS self-employment in my life! lol! Not to mention they don't have to mortgage their house to make it happen!

I'd say you should counsel a person on the choices that exist. Self-employment IS NOT for everyone and that is as much a factor in the exploration as determining WHAT type of employment will work!

I think for many folks its SALES that is the tricky thing! It takes a special personality to put that face forward--whether you are selling vibrators or Tupperware. Some people come by that naturally--others not--they shouldn't be swayed by the pitch!

I just thought I'd throw in my .02. Since I also work as an employment counselor, I could probaby go on and on with my opinions!!!

When will you start a program for workaholics??

Cheers!

Bri said: "I would like to make it clear that my organization in no way supports or condones MLM or network marketing companies. Is it bad to say that straight out?."

Uh... yeah.

While I think you should always make your point clear, it's how you state it in your terms and conditions or policy that will allow a person to make an informed decision as to whether they choose to be a part of your organization.

In today's business, people could care less what a person's choices are. If they truly believe in what they're doing, they could care less whether you condone it or not, which means you'll lose that percentage of Women in mlm, etc.

You shouldn't feel bad about that or "guilty." You're targeting a specific niche and it doesn't include mlm.

Just watch your wording and you'll be fine.

Best wishes!

Brianna... My sage advice is: keep your biz model (services offered) seperate from your personal beliefs (religion, politics, biases, prejudices, etc.) if you want the biz to succeed. Your clients will all have different needs and you should be open-minded enough to observe and recommend what is best for them from your experienced viewpoint.

If a potential client never gives you an opportunity to counsel them based on a pre - statement you've made and their perception is different from yours, then you'll never have the opportunity of potentially teaching them the pitfalls of some biz practices that you really want to share with them and help them avoid.

For Example: I personally do not smoke nor do I enjoy breathing second-hand smoke. I never impose this opinion on clients. Some of my best clients over the years that have benefitted from my services are heavy smokers. I have even watched some of them die from their habit. Never-the-less, I believe I had an impact on their business operations that may have never occured if I would have refused to offer my services to them based on my opinion of this personal choice.

Ultimately it is your biz and you get to choose how you are going to market your services. That is the joy of biz ownership. Never forget that you get to enjoy both the rewards and the pitfalls of your choices in how you market and operate your business.

And, last of all. Be careful about being judgemental of other's choices and you will have more opportunities to share your past experience and influence your clients towards a postive change.

Best of luck in your new venture....HH

I have a similar response. In fact I have two friends who have developed very strong MLM businesses and I actually feel that it is not good to make a judgment that all MLM businesses are bad. Like many of you, I have had the unfortunate experience of being badgered by people who want me to join their downline. On the other hand I also have had poor service from doctors, restaurants and many other businesses. In truth MLM is a very hard business to do well in. Really hard. It takes a certain type of person and most people who join do not have the skills or personality plus some people become like evangelists- but not all. I was in an MLM business once so I know. I loved the products but was not cut out for that type of business.

I think the best thing to do is to support people in their own choices and help them to look and make an educated decision. On the positive side the professional development part of the MLM business was excellent and I have kept much of what I learned and transferred it to other areas of my life.

To me most MLM's are all about signing up people for their downline instead of actually promoting a product.... I have issues with that concept....mostly due to the hype that is out there regarding just how great and how much money you can make my joining.. um....yeah...right.

Brianna... If your business is all about helping women with their OWN business then I would think ANY MLM would not fit in with your busines model...the MLM is not about promoting a product..its about increasing your downline.

Some folks need to do a little more research on MLMs and other pyramid schemes to find out why they are problematic, at best.

I've studied the subject because I have been on the fringes of four of the largest MLMs due to involvement of family and friends and their attempts to involve my wife and I. I was intrigued at first but was a bit suspicious of the validity of the model.

I've read their materials, been to their conferences/pep rallies and have heard their pitches. I've done the math. I've saved two friends and a family member from the trap. I've got one family member who is a successful MLM'er. I love her but she knows to keep that part of her life to herself.

Avoid getting caught up trying to be fair and non-judgmental about the people involved in MLMs. Concentrate on the details of the business model and do the numbers. Judge the MLM model, not the person trying to use it.

Nice people join such enterprises and most fail, as in any other business model. However, there are additional problems MLM'ers face that people using other business models don't face.

One of the most insidious elements of the business is the promoting of the "you can be anything you want to be" attitude to the level of brainwashing. Anyone who doesn't join your organization or who doesn't accept the MLM idea is by definition raining on your parade and needs to be flushed from your life so you can surround yourself with the MLM support machine.

The key thing to remember is that the serious money in an MLM business and the only way you can succeed in such a business model is to build an organization of distributors who have to do the same thing that you did to the impossible infinity of organizational size necessary for all in the organization to have a chance to succeed.

The success of this sort of business depends on building the organization, not selling the product. Sure, lots of product gets sold as distributors prey on all their family and friends. A lot of the money in MLMs comes from selling the positive thinking books and tapes and conferences that seem more like brainwashing than anything else.

The cynical underlying principle in the model is that for a few to succeed many can and will fail. You just have to build your business big enough to separate yourself from the churning going on at the outer limits of your own organization.

I could go on this rant for a long time but I'll spare you. Do the research.

There is a good reason to outlaw MLMs in this organization. Thanks to Dan and Lara for having the good sense to firewall Biznik from MLMs.

Great discussion, guys. For those interested in viewing Biznik's "No MLM" policy, go here:

(http://biznik.com/about/no_mlm)

This what it says:

Biznik is a niched networking group for indie businesses. We have made the decision not to extend membership to businesses that recruit members, resellers or distributors of products or services that do not originate with the person seeking membership to Biznik. Commonly known as multi level marketing (MLM) or network marketing companies, we have chosen to refer to our policy as a "No MLM" policy, despite the fact that some of those we exclude from membership may not actually be in a business that defines itself as an MLM. The keywords in our policy are, "recruit members, resellers or distributors" and products or services that "do not originate" with the person seeking membership.

We do not judge the merit or question the legitimacy of these businesses or of your business. Many business networking groups exclude MLMs, recruiters and distributors from their membership, Biznik is not alone in this policy. Though it is possible for a representative from a company to only promote their products inside a network and not recruit new distributors/resellers to their industry, Biznik has chosen not to engage valuable resources attempting to enforce this.

I have to say something here. This is the first time I've commented on one of these blogs, but it bothers me when people voice their opinions without first doing their homework, mainly what direct marketing, (MLM was an outdated term in the early 90's), really means. There are bad apples in any industry, (someone said used care sales people-there are actually good people there too), give me a break! Whether you're selling flowers, your own web design business, working as a PI or promoting a non-profit, there are bad people everywhere. Don't condemn someone for trying to build a business, and don't condemn a type of business because you know someone who's uncle knew somebody who screwed them on some pyramid scheme 20 years ago. Most people who actually fail in that type of business do so because they did not want to work that hard. Educate yourself on what the direct marketing industry is really all about and know that the real pyramid scheme is in corporate America where you're never going to make as much as the people at the top. I know, I was there for over 15 years and with that said, I wouldn't go back now and do anything different - I learned a lot there. Keep an open mind, make sure you run your business, whatever it is, in an ethical and respectful manner. I have people close to me that are successful and very ethical and have a sincere desire to help other people with their direct marketing business and they realize it's not for everyone. They are truly independent business people! There are people I choose not to do business with either, but I don't determine it by the type of business they work in or promote as long at it is in line with my core values. Bottom line, everyone should do a little research before bashing a person or business. Thank you.

I know you've made your decision, Brianna, and it sounds like there's been some great discussion and advice here. I'd just like to add for anyone reading this that in your own business, you have the freedom to include only the people you'd like to work with. It's not your job to include everyone (or every type of business).

I know it may seem like a "good" person is one who is all-inclusive, but that can sometimes be a mental trap that allows people and organizations that take advantage into your life (I'm speaking in general here, not specifically about any particular type of person or organization).

I think it's very admirable to have an open mind, and I strive for that myself. AND I think it's honoring myself and my integrity to decide to say "no" to some people...to exclude some potential clients from my practice, to decide to not befriend some people. It's not my duty to like or be completely open to everyone at the expense of myself or my business.

You could say I'm "discriminating," true, but, honestly, aren't we all choosing whom to work with and whom to not? I don't like working with the chronically mentally ill...does that make me a bad person? I don't think so. It's just not my calling to do that--luckily I know many other therapists who DO have that calling...and funny enough, they aren't called to do the work I do. :)